Kai wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 10:21 pmMight be time for a general "Today's Conflict" thread, that one should keep running foreverShaunWhite wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 3:49 pmUnless there's a market for it then save it for X?
You could fill the front page with all the various global conflicts.
I agree (claimed) "baby and child-slaughtering" is totally unacceptable but to say "the images are too horrific to show" could be used to claim anything and not evidence it! But in the past when Palestinians committed acts of terrorism and Israel retaliated with indiscriminate bombing of Gaza Strip resulting in "baby and child-slaughtering" why did The World not condemn Israel's actions?Crazyskier wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 10:50 pmIrrespective of your faith or political leanings, the recent baby and child-slaughtering committed by Hamas, can have no justification whatsoever.
These deplorable actions must be condemned for the terrorist atrocities they are. I also believe those condoning such sickening killings should be prosecuted for supporting terrorism.
CS
excellent summation - !!firlandsfarm wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2023 9:51 amI agree (claimed) "baby and child-slaughtering" is totally unacceptable but to say "the images are too horrific to show" could be used to claim anything and not evidence it! But in the past when Palestinians committed acts of terrorism and Israel retaliated with indiscriminate bombing of Gaza Strip resulting in "baby and child-slaughtering" why did The World not condemn Israel's actions?Crazyskier wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 10:50 pmIrrespective of your faith or political leanings, the recent baby and child-slaughtering committed by Hamas, can have no justification whatsoever.
These deplorable actions must be condemned for the terrorist atrocities they are. I also believe those condoning such sickening killings should be prosecuted for supporting terrorism.
CS
This 'war' goes back to 1948 when the now state of Israel took control of vast areas of then Palestine and declared UDI over it exiling Palestinians out of their homes and country and they have continually expanded their borders since then pushing and squeezing the Palestinians into ever smaller lands. I don't agree with the Palestinian tactics but Israel and The World are not innocent in this. Israel has been allowed to get away with a form of terrorism over the Palestinians since 1948 and refuses the two state solution. If Germany had 'won' WW2 and the UK was now part of a German Empire do you think we would stop fighting to win our country back?
To the Palestinians Gaza is a prison with 3 million inmates. Israel controls what goes in and what comes out (not very well so it seems if thousands of rockets have been smuggled in!). But why has Hamas embarked on what most would see to be a suicide mission and what does Israel hope to achieve with what we are led to believe to be 300,000 troops ready to invade? Anything those troops do will only stiffen the resolve of the Palestinians that evade Israel's retaliation. Israel has a choice ... negotiate a peaceful resolution whereby they return some land back to the Palestinians or accept that they will live under the constant threat further attacks.
There is probably more to this than meets the eye ... Hamas are probably being supplied by Iran and Iran is probably being supplied by Russia who (again probably) see Israel as an offshore state of the USA ... but that's just conjecture!
BTW in case some think I have an axe to grind over this ... I am not Arabic nor Israeli, I am not Muslim nor Jew ... I'm just white CoE! My interest is because my ex is of Jewish/Israeli decent and her father was British and served in the Palestinian Police Force through the conflict of the late 1940's after the end of WW2 and kept a daily diary of events which I have.
Bard summarised the conflict of more recent years as ...
"1948: The Arab-Israeli War of 1948 broke out, following the declaration of independence of the State of Israel. The war ended with Israel in control of most of the territory that had been allocated to it under the UN partition plan, as well as additional territory that had been allocated to the Palestinian Arabs.
1949: The Palestinian refugee crisis began, as hundreds of thousands of Palestinians fled or were expelled from their homes in Israel.
1967: The Six-Day War broke out between Israel and its Arab neighbors. Israel emerged victorious from the war, occupying the West Bank, Gaza Strip, Sinai Peninsula, and Golan Heights.
1973: The Yom Kippur War broke out between Israel and its Arab neighbors. Israel again emerged victorious from the war, but at a high cost.
1978: The Camp David Accords were signed between Israel and Egypt, leading to the withdrawal of Israeli forces from the Sinai Peninsula.
1993: The Oslo Accords were signed between Israel and the Palestinian Liberation Organization (PLO), leading to the establishment of the Palestinian Authority (PA).
2000: The Second Intifada, a Palestinian uprising against Israeli occupation, began.
2005: Israel withdrew its forces from the Gaza Strip, but maintained a blockade and control over the territory's borders.
2014: The Gaza War broke out between Israel and Hamas. The war ended with a ceasefire, but the conflict remains unresolved.
The war that began on October 7, 2023 is the latest chapter in this long and complex conflict.
It is important to note that there are many different perspectives on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, and that the above is just a brief overview of some of the key milestones."
No it's not... (but maybe you meant Bard's summation)jimibt wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2023 10:20 amexcellent summation - !!firlandsfarm wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2023 9:51 amI agree (claimed) "baby and child-slaughtering" is totally unacceptable but to say "the images are too horrific to show" could be used to claim anything and not evidence it! But in the past when Palestinians committed acts of terrorism and Israel retaliated with indiscriminate bombing of Gaza Strip resulting in "baby and child-slaughtering" why did The World not condemn Israel's actions?Crazyskier wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 10:50 pmIrrespective of your faith or political leanings, the recent baby and child-slaughtering committed by Hamas, can have no justification whatsoever.
These deplorable actions must be condemned for the terrorist atrocities they are. I also believe those condoning such sickening killings should be prosecuted for supporting terrorism.
CS
This 'war' goes back to 1948 when the now state of Israel took control of vast areas of then Palestine and declared UDI over it exiling Palestinians out of their homes and country and they have continually expanded their borders since then pushing and squeezing the Palestinians into ever smaller lands. I don't agree with the Palestinian tactics but Israel and The World are not innocent in this. Israel has been allowed to get away with a form of terrorism over the Palestinians since 1948 and refuses the two state solution. If Germany had 'won' WW2 and the UK was now part of a German Empire do you think we would stop fighting to win our country back?
To the Palestinians Gaza is a prison with 3 million inmates. Israel controls what goes in and what comes out (not very well so it seems if thousands of rockets have been smuggled in!). But why has Hamas embarked on what most would see to be a suicide mission and what does Israel hope to achieve with what we are led to believe to be 300,000 troops ready to invade? Anything those troops do will only stiffen the resolve of the Palestinians that evade Israel's retaliation. Israel has a choice ... negotiate a peaceful resolution whereby they return some land back to the Palestinians or accept that they will live under the constant threat further attacks.
There is probably more to this than meets the eye ... Hamas are probably being supplied by Iran and Iran is probably being supplied by Russia who (again probably) see Israel as an offshore state of the USA ... but that's just conjecture!
BTW in case some think I have an axe to grind over this ... I am not Arabic nor Israeli, I am not Muslim nor Jew ... I'm just white CoE! My interest is because my ex is of Jewish/Israeli decent and her father was British and served in the Palestinian Police Force through the conflict of the late 1940's after the end of WW2 and kept a daily diary of events which I have.
Bard summarised the conflict of more recent years as ...
"1948: The Arab-Israeli War of 1948 broke out, following the declaration of independence of the State of Israel. The war ended with Israel in control of most of the territory that had been allocated to it under the UN partition plan, as well as additional territory that had been allocated to the Palestinian Arabs.
1949: The Palestinian refugee crisis began, as hundreds of thousands of Palestinians fled or were expelled from their homes in Israel.
1967: The Six-Day War broke out between Israel and its Arab neighbors. Israel emerged victorious from the war, occupying the West Bank, Gaza Strip, Sinai Peninsula, and Golan Heights.
1973: The Yom Kippur War broke out between Israel and its Arab neighbors. Israel again emerged victorious from the war, but at a high cost.
1978: The Camp David Accords were signed between Israel and Egypt, leading to the withdrawal of Israeli forces from the Sinai Peninsula.
1993: The Oslo Accords were signed between Israel and the Palestinian Liberation Organization (PLO), leading to the establishment of the Palestinian Authority (PA).
2000: The Second Intifada, a Palestinian uprising against Israeli occupation, began.
2005: Israel withdrew its forces from the Gaza Strip, but maintained a blockade and control over the territory's borders.
2014: The Gaza War broke out between Israel and Hamas. The war ended with a ceasefire, but the conflict remains unresolved.
The war that began on October 7, 2023 is the latest chapter in this long and complex conflict.
It is important to note that there are many different perspectives on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, and that the above is just a brief overview of some of the key milestones."
I'm glad that you agree that beheading of children and burning people alive is unacceptable. I'm appalled that you are trying to suggest that dropping bombs, something we did extensively over Berlin and Dresden, etc, in WW2 which however targeted, are by their very nature 'indiscriminate,' is somehow akin to beheading babies in front of their Mothers. To burning people alive. To raping Mothers in front of their children. THIS is what the Hamas terrorists have done, with well over 1,000 deaths and thousands injured and dozens taken captive!firlandsfarm wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2023 9:51 amCrazyskier wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 10:50 pmIrrespective of your faith or political leanings, the recent baby and child-slaughtering committed by Hamas, can have no justification whatsoever.
These deplorable actions must be condemned for the terrorist atrocities they are. I also believe those condoning such sickening killings should be prosecuted for supporting terrorism.
CS
I agree (claimed) "baby and child-slaughtering" is totally unacceptable. But in the past when Palestinians committed acts of terrorism and Israel retaliated with indiscriminate bombing of Gaza Strip resulting in "baby and child-slaughtering" why did The World not condemn Israel's actions?
Oh dear, what is it about some on these forums, why do they not read what is said?Crazyskier wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2023 10:51 amI'm glad that you agree that beheading of children and burning people alive is unacceptable. I'm appalled that you are trying to suggest that dropping bombs, something we did extensively over Berlin and Dresden, etc, in WW2 which however targeted, are by their very nature 'indiscriminate,' is somehow akin to beheading babies in front of their Mothers. To burning people alive. To raping Mothers in front of their children. THIS is what the Hamas terrorists have done, with well over 1,000 deaths and thousands injured and dozens taken captive!
I am not Jewish, but find myself sickened by your seeming attempt to draw parallels. There are none. There can be no justification. Please do not try to muddy the waters as so many of the terrorist-supporting scum are doing by openly celebrating and condoning these horrific actions.
CS
AgreedArchery1969 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 11, 2023 10:59 amThe answer is not for Israel to go in and be part of mass murder.
All that will do is fuel further Arab/Jewish tentions and bring others into the mix.
I hear what you're saying Peter. Challenge accepted!
