Hi all,
When I use automation in Betangel Betdaq and try to use a small stake, Guardian pops up a message saying I have to use £1 minimum stake.
I am a bit confused as Peters video's say we can place bets at as low as 1p and don't need practice mode on Betdaq.
I can place lower stakes using Betangel Professional on Betfair Automation, so what is stopping me on Betdaq?
Betangel Betdaq Minimum Stake Message??
Unfortunately it's not economic for Betdaq to process thousands of automated bets to 1p stakes, so we have put a minimum stake level in the automation to make it viable.
We've noticed Betfair are starting to pester people who have a zero balance and no betting activity at the moment. So it looks like they are less than happy at practice mode only business.
I think it's rational and sensible to have some activity on your account to prove your 'worth' to either exchange.
We've noticed Betfair are starting to pester people who have a zero balance and no betting activity at the moment. So it looks like they are less than happy at practice mode only business.
I think it's rational and sensible to have some activity on your account to prove your 'worth' to either exchange.
That contradicts what Peter says on his video, he seems to think Betdaq are fine with small stakes as even small stakes add to their liquidity.
I wasn't thinking of doing 1p stakes as that would be to low for trading purposes, but I would like to use the automation trading at Betdaq's own minimum stake of 50p.
Why is it set at £1, double Betdaq's own minimum Stake?
I wasn't thinking of doing 1p stakes as that would be to low for trading purposes, but I would like to use the automation trading at Betdaq's own minimum stake of 50p.
Why is it set at £1, double Betdaq's own minimum Stake?
Thats fine, I thought the stakes had been done in error, I now realise that I was misinformed about the minimum stakes, and the doubling of the stake limit is deliberate.
I will look at other platforms to do my low stake testing.
Thank you for your replies.
I will look at other platforms to do my low stake testing.
Thank you for your replies.
With deference to Gary, can you see the impossible position we are in with regard to Betdaq?
People complained that they couldn't use Betdaq because they didn't have software that was equal in terms of functionality. So we upgrade the software, at our expense, pushed through changes at Betdaq on their API that benefit the whole marketplace and Betdaq change their commission structure. Yet still people are very reluctant to put any real money through on Betdaq.
That is while Betfair will keep on jacking up charges as much as they can. They are also getting aggressive on restricting accounts by proxy when they don't put through enough volume. They are really turning the screw at both ends.
But there needs to be a concerted effort to put good money through the Betdaq markets if they are to grow and compete.
When we dropped the automation into the Betdaq product we were pretty sure this would do the trick as people don't actually need to be near their PC to run or make it work. Also, even if you are using small stakes at random, your net loss over the long term will be tiny with commission at 2% on Betdaq.
We need much stronger adoption of Betdaq. Any additional volume will help no matter how small. I'm not asking people to shift their business to Betdaq. Just saying that if Betdaq grow it will benefit the entire trading community.
We have invested a lot of time and effort in producing a top class product for Betdaq. We need people to use it else, even we wouldn't have much leverage from Betdaq to invest it in going forward.
People complained that they couldn't use Betdaq because they didn't have software that was equal in terms of functionality. So we upgrade the software, at our expense, pushed through changes at Betdaq on their API that benefit the whole marketplace and Betdaq change their commission structure. Yet still people are very reluctant to put any real money through on Betdaq.
That is while Betfair will keep on jacking up charges as much as they can. They are also getting aggressive on restricting accounts by proxy when they don't put through enough volume. They are really turning the screw at both ends.
But there needs to be a concerted effort to put good money through the Betdaq markets if they are to grow and compete.
When we dropped the automation into the Betdaq product we were pretty sure this would do the trick as people don't actually need to be near their PC to run or make it work. Also, even if you are using small stakes at random, your net loss over the long term will be tiny with commission at 2% on Betdaq.
We need much stronger adoption of Betdaq. Any additional volume will help no matter how small. I'm not asking people to shift their business to Betdaq. Just saying that if Betdaq grow it will benefit the entire trading community.
We have invested a lot of time and effort in producing a top class product for Betdaq. We need people to use it else, even we wouldn't have much leverage from Betdaq to invest it in going forward.
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andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
+1
It has been perfectly tradeable over this Christmas period. And would have been an ideal opportunity for people to trade on there.
I can see how people who put large stakes through will struggle, but if you are putting smaller stakes through there really is no issue. So it is ideal for new people coming to trading.
It has been perfectly tradeable over this Christmas period. And would have been an ideal opportunity for people to trade on there.
I can see how people who put large stakes through will struggle, but if you are putting smaller stakes through there really is no issue. So it is ideal for new people coming to trading.
At 2% commision everyone should be trying it, a £1 minimum stake is well low enough to loss next to nothing in the long run, i use lots of small amounts of money and try and turn it over as much as i can on betdaq my orders seem to be getting filled quicker.
I have taken out the 14 day trial using betfair
I have a betdaq account
Will I be able to take another trial using betdaq at the end of the betfair trial?
Also I'm greening up on horse racing but using "making market" link
Although results ok I'm not 100% sure what I'm doing
Any suggestions where I can see simple example on you tube?
I have a betdaq account
Will I be able to take another trial using betdaq at the end of the betfair trial?
Also I'm greening up on horse racing but using "making market" link
Although results ok I'm not 100% sure what I'm doing
Any suggestions where I can see simple example on you tube?
I would just like to say that the purpose of my post was to bring attention to what I thought was an error in the staking amount.
I agree that it would be good for betdaq to challenge the betfair monopoly of exchange trading, and I applaud your efforts to get people to use betdaq.
But I feel that bringing new people in by telling them they can use 1p stakes to test strategies instead of providing practice mode, then saying, oh, we have decided to put minimum stakes to £1, double betdaqs own minimum stake, to help betdaqs liquidity will not do that.
I already have Betangel Professional so can use practice mode on that, this issue came to light when I wanted to test some strategies with minimum stakes on betdaq, thinking Betangel would allow me to do what they advertised.
Others might be happy with it, but it left me feeling decieved.
I agree that it would be good for betdaq to challenge the betfair monopoly of exchange trading, and I applaud your efforts to get people to use betdaq.
But I feel that bringing new people in by telling them they can use 1p stakes to test strategies instead of providing practice mode, then saying, oh, we have decided to put minimum stakes to £1, double betdaqs own minimum stake, to help betdaqs liquidity will not do that.
I already have Betangel Professional so can use practice mode on that, this issue came to light when I wanted to test some strategies with minimum stakes on betdaq, thinking Betangel would allow me to do what they advertised.
Others might be happy with it, but it left me feeling decieved.
Peter's plea for using Betdaq has certainly struck a chord with me. Although it will be outside my comfort zone of the BF market...I think we all in the trading community have a responsibility to support Peter's drive in supporting BD. He clearly has the best interests of the trading community at heart and i can fully understand his logic re supporting BD to help it grow. It is no good simply moaning about BF charges/approach etc when PW has presented us with a free and cheaper viable alternative. Am actively considering now how and when i try BD..but i think others like myself only still learning the ropes need to get behind PW's drive for BD!
Sorry you feel deceived, but please have look at the commercial issues.garryjc wrote:Others might be happy with it, but it left me feeling decieved.
We don't make any money on the software, so we ask Betdaq for money to help fund it's development; but nobody is really using it. So they can't really give us more money unless it's value is demonstrated.
Min bets of 50p or 1p (which we pushed through for approval at Betdaq incidentally), yields pretty much no commission at 2% @ 1p * .02% = £0 - 50p at 2% = £0.01p but if your strike rate is less than 50% then that also more or less equals zero. Ok for manual trading or betting, as you learn to use the software but not viable for thousands of automated bets.
Neither Betfair nor Betdaq are viable at small stakes and both will
At least at £1 they will get 2p if you win or in the long term if you have a 50/50 strike rate they will get 1p.
Still somewhat short of Betfair's £50m or so marketing budget but it's a step in the right direction.
The other thing that can help is word of mouth, that's how Betfair built their core user base. But of course now it's built on uneconomic introductory offers to mug punters and octopuses.
TBH, we need a lot more support on the software as well so any help would be appreciated.
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andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
What sort of help are you looking for Peter?Euler wrote:TBH, we need a lot more support on the software as well so any help would be appreciated.
Your information showing betdaqs commercial interests are very logical and make a lot of sense from their perspective, and I understand that a successful betdaq is in all our long term interests.
Personally I have been supporting betdaq from their start, on their own site, in my own small way, this is why I wanted to test the betdaq free software, and automation, to see if it was viable to put more money through them using your software.
Selfishly perhaps, I have to look at my own commercial interests, and protecting my bank is number one.
I greatly admire the Betangel software and the extensive video support available, this is what encouraged me to test the betdaq free software, and to purchase Betangel professional in the first place.
Keep up the good work.
Regards
Garry
Personally I have been supporting betdaq from their start, on their own site, in my own small way, this is why I wanted to test the betdaq free software, and automation, to see if it was viable to put more money through them using your software.
Selfishly perhaps, I have to look at my own commercial interests, and protecting my bank is number one.
I greatly admire the Betangel software and the extensive video support available, this is what encouraged me to test the betdaq free software, and to purchase Betangel professional in the first place.
Keep up the good work.
Regards
Garry