Getting started with Scalping

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Silver Lining
Posts: 52
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:33 pm

Hi all,

I am a complete virgin to sports trading and Bet Angel software (and the BA forum). I have not as yet purchased BA software or entered any trades. I have however been doing a little matched betting using bookies offers over recent months.

Can anyone out there clarify some of the following points:

1) Is it possible to make any money scalping using £2 stakes with an offset of 1 tick. Using my old matched betting calculator if I enter £2 stake with back odds 6.0 and lay @ 5.8 this shows a -£0.02 loss after commission is deducted.

2) How much liquidity should I look for that suggests the market is ideal for scalping

3) I have heard a lot of mention about WOM. What should I be looking for with regard to WOM and what does it suggest

4) What options do I have for baling out if my opening back/lay bet is filled but my offset bet remains unmatched as I will then be in a position of liability.
iambic_pentameter
Posts: 443
Joined: Wed May 18, 2016 1:24 pm

Welcome to the forum.

Don't get too obsessed / hung up on scalping; there are plenty of ways to trade the racing markets - swing trading, range trading etc.

If you've not already done so, check out the Bet Angel Academy and the Bet Angel YouTube channel - lots of useful information there - including some good videos on scalping.

A good course of action would be to spend an afternoon in practice mode learning how Bet Angel works and then watching the markets and using £2 stakes. Pay attention to how you react when you lose money.

To quote George Soros:

"It's not whether you are right or wrong thats important, but how much money you make when you are right and how much you lose when you are wrong"

Finally, there are some very sharp minds on this forum and I've learnt a lot by reading other people's posts - a good starting point would be the series written by JollyGreen:

viewforum.php?f=2

Best of luck with it.

Iambic
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ShaunWhite
Posts: 9731
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 3:42 am

Silver Lining wrote:
Mon Jul 16, 2018 2:03 pm
1) Is it possible to make any money scalping using £2 stakes with an offset of 1 tick.
If you can't make money with £2 you aren't going ot make money with £200
Silver Lining wrote:
Mon Jul 16, 2018 2:03 pm
Using my old matched betting calculator if I enter £2 stake with back odds 6.0 and lay @ 5.8 this shows a -£0.02 loss after commission is deducted.
Back high & lay low and you're showing a loss? ... I'd have another look at your calculator.
It's 7p profit after commish. Commission is only paid on your net position not the back & lay profits seperately
Silver Lining wrote:
Mon Jul 16, 2018 2:03 pm
2) How much liquidity should I look for that suggests the market is ideal for scalping
Low volatility is more use than low liquidity but the 2 usually go roughly together. There's no 'ideal' you just want static or narrow ranging markets.
Silver Lining wrote:
Mon Jul 16, 2018 2:03 pm
3) I have heard a lot of mention about WOM. What should I be looking for with regard to WOM and what does it suggest
The jury is split on WoM. Tons of info on the forum.
Silver Lining wrote:
Mon Jul 16, 2018 2:03 pm
4) What options do I have for baling out if my opening back/lay bet is filled but my offset bet remains unmatched as I will then be in a position of liability.
Just take the loss at best price


One question, why scalping? Personally I think opportunities are few and far between and it's really difficult if you're totally new because it takes speed and awareness of things that can suddenly go wrong. I'd always recommend looking at swing trading first so that you have more than a nano second to act and you'll get a much better understanding of what's going on.

Scalping is generally sold as being easy because it's looks easy and because of that it generates ebook sales. Doing it is another matter.
Silver Lining
Posts: 52
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:33 pm

Much appreciated replies. I fully intend to start by using £2 stakes but assumed that only using a 1 tick offset would not be profitable. The calculator I normally use for matched betting only has 2% & 5% commission options. I have since used another online calculator and agree with the 0.07 profit. However, as soon as I put the Commission back on I get the -0.03 loss. I guess what you are saying is that I am only charged commission on my net gains ie 5% of 0.007 profit.

Is there anything on the forum about how long you can use Bet Angel practice mode before having you account restricted. I have heard somewhere that this can happen if used too often?

Thanks again for your help
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Derek27
Posts: 23468
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2017 11:44 am
Location: UK

Silver Lining wrote:
Mon Jul 16, 2018 3:43 pm
Much appreciated replies. I fully intend to start by using £2 stakes but assumed that only using a 1 tick offset would not be profitable. The calculator I normally use for matched betting only has 2% & 5% commission options. I have since used another online calculator and agree with the 0.07 profit. However, as soon as I put the Commission back on I get the -0.03 loss. I guess what you are saying is that I am only charged commission on my net gains ie 5% of 0.007 profit.

Is there anything on the forum about how long you can use Bet Angel practice mode before having you account restricted. I have heard somewhere that this can happen if used too often?

Thanks again for your help
Are you talking about scalping the Betfair market or match betting?

If you back at 5.1 and lay at 5.0 you don't need a commission calculator because you only pay commission on your market profit. You have a (£2*0.1) £0.20 free bet. You then green up to (£0.20/5) £0.04.

If you're successful and you increase stakes to £20, 40p may not be much but you'd be surprised how quickly it all adds up if you can get it right.
JTEDL
Posts: 536
Joined: Wed Aug 23, 2017 2:21 pm

That's correct - easier set commission to 0% on matched betting calc, then take 5% off the figure you have
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ShaunWhite
Posts: 9731
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 3:42 am

If you search the forum you'll see several threads about account restrictions.

That trade....eg..

(6.0-5.8) x £200 = £40.00 free bet
£4/5.8 = £6.90 hedged
- 5% = £6.50 profit
Last edited by ShaunWhite on Mon Jul 16, 2018 4:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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ShaunWhite
Posts: 9731
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 3:42 am

:) beat me to it Derek
Silver Lining
Posts: 52
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:33 pm

Thank you very much for your replies. I really appreciate the fact that despite sports trading being a competitive market, there are people out there willing to share their experience and help others.


Thanks again,
Mick :)
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