Betfair's stance on collaborative trading and syndicates

[Kai]

Where does Betfair draw the line with collaborative trading and syndicates, if anywhere?

Any explicit rules that users should know, or things that BF frowns upon? Besides the obvious stuff like PC evasion.

By collaborative trading I mean different individuals consistently trading the same markets with the same strategies. Not for the purposes of manipulating those markets in any way, but only because some markets are big enough to share opportunities.

Appreciate any insight and input.

[ShaunWhite]

Who can say what collab algos would get triggered. But syndicates I know of use a business account so the mechanism is there.

... And are you taking millisecond synchronisity or a general 'do this and that'?

[ShaunWhite]

because some markets are big enough to share opportunities.

[Kai]

And are you taking millisecond synchronisity or a general 'do this and that'?

Curious about both really.

About casual co-op sessions where opportunities are shared but execution of them is mostly individual, and about sharing some of the same pieces of automation.

Obviously would always want to remain on good terms with Betfair, so I'd always ask around within Betfair first for confirmation about anything specific.

Just thought I'd tap into the collective forum hivemind for a moment to at least get some general do's and don'ts, if possible.

If someone is not comfortable discussing it openly, I don't mind them PMing me either

[napshnap]

I remember scary stories that if you got banned and sold or gave your strategy/bot to some other individual, he'll get banned too.

[Euler]

You can get a corporate account with Betfair: -

https://support.betfair.com/app/answers ... process%3F

We have a number of Bet Angel clients who are corporations and syndicates. But I've never really asked them questions about structure as it's not really any of my business.

[Kai]

We have a number of Bet Angel clients who are corporations and syndicates.

Good to know, thanks

[Kai]

I remember scary stories that if you got banned and sold or gave your strategy/bot to some other individual, he'll get banned too.

Well I sort of heard the opposite, like a few traders that worked on an "inplay bot" together and then used the same one on their own accounts, and this apparently worked well.

So I'm also curious about the limits of separate account collab.

[napshnap]

I remember scary stories that if you got banned and sold or gave your strategy/bot to some other individual, he'll get banned too.

Well I sort of heard the opposite, like a few traders that worked on an "inplay bot" together and then used the same one on their own accounts, and this apparently worked well.

So I'm also curious about the limits of separate account collab.

Our world would be such a lovely place without criminal minded assholes! We have to have "gray zones" cause of them. It would be awesome to have clear rules in bf's t&c about this problem or that Derek related (when they banned him for email change). But NO! - assholes exploitable "gray zones"!

[ShaunWhite]

But NO! - assholes exploitable "gray zones"!

They can't give the hard and fast rules because it's so variable, and besides if you quote rules then people know exactly to what extent they can push them. It's the same as its been with api misuse, 'grey zones' give them the flexibility to protect you from rule benders.

[napshnap]

But NO! - assholes exploitable "gray zones"!

They can't give the hard and fast rules because it's so variable, and besides if you quote rules then people know exactly to what extent they can push them. It's the same as its been with api misuse, 'grey zones' give them the flexibility to protect you from rule benders.

Yeah, and we have to rely on the judge (that's not supercomfortable) when we get involved into these grey zones, and, thank God, the juge (bf) is still fair (knock on wood).

[ShaunWhite]

Yeah, and we have to rely on the judge (that's not supercomfortable) when we get involved into these grey zones, and, thank God, the juge (bf) is still fair (knock on wood).

Get it. I don't see a problem with this type of collab or any really. Markets are small and the big shots are maximising their edges anyway. And every video claiming to share 'secrets' incl the! BA ones are technically sharing anyway.

Tbh naps what I find more upsetting are the AccaBots Dallas is posting. Those need a big red warning "Novelty betting only - Not intended to be serious"... They're just an optimist's Martingale.

[Kai]

They're just an optimist's Martingale.

There is really no need to throw the M-word around, let's try and keep things civil

How about a hypothetical question instead, if Naps sent you a working piece of auto would you run it simultaneously with him no questions asked? (For simplicity sake let's say you're both from the UK)

[Euler]

Tbh naps what I find more upsetting are the AccaBots Dallas is posting. Those need a big red warning "Novelty betting only - Not intended to be serious"... They're just an optimist's Martingale.

I asked Dallas to create these as there are no Accas on the exchange, you get pushed to the sportsbook. I'd rather have them out there than not and there are lots of clever variations you can do on these at full margin, than you can do with a normal, badly priced, sportsbook acca.

[Euler]

I would have thought trust is the main consideration when working with others.

I've some stuff with Star Lizard and they firewall a lot of stuff so one side doesn't know what the other is doing. I think the problem with sports related stuff is scale. So it's difficult to share with too many people before you impact it's ability to be effective or get gain by expanding the strategy.

I guess that assumptive on the basis I don't know the underlying reasons.